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What You’ll Discover in this Episode:

The Place of Eschatology in Biblical Counseling

As we look at our culture today, we look at what’s going on in the world​, and someone says these are signs of the times. Jesus said when you see these things begin to happen we, “Look up for your redemption is drawing near.” This is our reminder that God is in control.

Because of this, we need to know what is happening in our world And the Book of Revelation contains a lot of Bible prophecy. This is also called eschatology, the study of end times events.

Contrary to what some people might say that this is too complex, the Bible says we should know these matters. Jesus said when you see the abomination of desolation spoken up by Daniel the prophet, he says, “Let the reader understand.” It means, we absolutely can understand it. 

It is God’s desire to reveal, not to conceal. So, we don’t have to be afraid of this topic. These hard truths about God’s wrath are not in the Bible to scare us, but to prepare us. “Blessed is he who reads and hears the word of this prophecy and keeps the things in it because the time is near.” Revelation 1:3

​True studying of Revelation is also true of studying Bible prophecy​.

  1. Studying Bible prophecy helps me to remember that God is in control of all events in the world today.
  2. It gives you a heavenly perspective.

Are you ready?

And I think if you really believe that Christ could come back at any time, it will affect you in the way that you live. So if you understand Bible prophecy as you ought to, it will have a spiritually purifying effect, a positive effect on your life. There’s a lot of things that the Bible predicts that are happening before us. No doubt about it. We are living in the last days. 

I think I can safely say that we’ve never been closer to the return of Jesus Christ than we are right here, right now. We need to be ready.

Share your thoughts and comments below!


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  • Interesting podcast on “The Place of Eschatology in Biblical Counseling”, thanks to Pastor Jeff. As mentioned in the program, the role of eschatology in biblical counseling has not played a prominent role historically, however, there are solid practical and biblical reasons why it is important. The imminent return of Christ and rapture of the church before the seven-year tribulation period helps remind us of three critical points: 1. God is in control of all world events, He is sovereign 2. It reminds us to “look up” and have a heavenly or eternal perspective and 3. Understanding eschatology has a purifying effect o the life of the believer.

    The point that stands out to me especially, is the fact that no matter how chaotic and frightening our world may seem, God still reigns sovereign on the throne. When counseling people that are experiencing high levels of anxiety concerning the future, it is most helpful to remind them that none of the crazy events we’ve been witnessing in recent years, like Covid, the rise of the LGBTQ movement, racial divide, and global conflict/terrorism, catch God off guard. As Pastor Jeff said, “things are going according to schedule”. At the end of the day, I read the end of the book and God wins and therefore we win.

    • Very good summary of the podcast! Our world is absolutely so upside and sideways right now it can be alarming. But understanding that God’s wrath has been taken care of for us “the church”, “the bride” brings such comfort and hope.

      • Yes, on the cross Christ took the wrath and punishment that was ours. There is no longer any judgement remaining other than the Bema Seat judgment for believers. It is hard to understand how some believe that Christians will have to go through any part of the Tribulation. Jesus’ suffering and death were enough. He said it was finished. He perfectly atoned for our sins.

        • Amen and thanks for sharing, Angela. I love how you mentioned that “there is no more judgement remaining other than the Bema Seat judgement for believers.” It’s so comforting to know that we are saved by God’s grace through faith in Christ alone. The work has been done and it is finished. I love how Romans 4:4-5 mentions, “Now to him who works, the wages are not counted as grace but as debt. But to him who does not work but believes on Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is accounted for righteousness.” I was reminded of this verse when you mentioned , “He perfectly atoned for our sins.” It is finished! Amen. Thanks for sharing. I was refreshed after reading this post.

          • Thank you Oliver! Let’s keep resting in our faith and all He has done for us! He is Worthy!

    • I like how you mentioned the high level of anxiety many are having due to the current affairs of the world. As you mentioned, this anxiety can be used as a gateway to share the hope and comfort we have through the knowledge of the sovereignty of God. I have seen this fear open the door in conversation for evangelism even with perfect strangers several times within this past year. The more that we study what the Lord has revealed about the signs of the times, the more we will be able to share comfort and hope to believers and unbelievers alike.

      • I’ll admit, the first time I attempted to read the book of Revelation, I got anxiety thinking of all those things happening and me or my loved ones experiencing them. But I revisited it again, this time completely firm in my belief that I was part of His church. I think a lot of people call themselves Christian but are unsure of their Salvation and that tends to produce anxiety as well.

        • I was the same way going into the Book of Revelation. The assurance and blessing of reading, hearing and keeping those things which are written in them, as the time draws near, brings so much comfort to know how things will play out. The anxiety and fear of the unknown has been revealed to us in the Book of Revelation and I’m amazed how God tells us through His word so that we might prepare ourselves now to meet our Lord and Savior. I love what P. Jeff said in that it’s written not to scare, but to prepare people of what’s to come. Such an awesome God! He let’s us know of what’s to come, He gives clarity on how it will take place, and the assurance to know that salvation is of the Lord and those who believe in Christ Jesus will reign with Him in eternity. I’m looking up! Come, Lord Jesus!

    • Thank you Sumit. Anxiety comes when we lose or doubt in our trust in God. Knowing that He is in control can really get our feet back on the ground, and walking with Him.

    • Thank you for sharing Sumit. It is so comforting knowing that God is in control. Even when all these strange things are happening in the world. Things that doesn’t make sense like what you mention racial divide and others. Also, Pastor Jeff mentioned what is right is wrong in our society, and what is wrong is right. Thanks be to our Heavenly Father that He is still sitting on His throne.

    • You make a really good point Sumit. There is so much that is happening and to remind those that are stressed or are anxious need to remember, everything is on schedule. It may seem to be chaos in the world but we should be looking up and looking forward to what is to come..

    • Thank you,
      Amen God is sovereign, the enemy wants to deceive and show us that chaos in in control but it is not. Amazing things are happening, new believers, new churches, new ministries, new babies being born. God is been the centerpiece from the beginning. Thank you for sharing God bless

    • Thank you @SumitDas – agreed. While I believe strongly that Eschatology bears great importance, I feel it is primary that we fall back on the promise of God’s Sovereignty and take solace in that fact. No matter what the world or the end of times throws our way we are shrouded in His love and protection. I love that you say: “I have read the end of the book – GOD WINS!”

    • “I read the end of the book, God wins and therefore we win.” Amen to that! I too look around me in complete amazement (not a good kind of amazement) on the things being viewed as normal and or acceptable. But in the end, I have to remember that
      ” It is written..” and believe that though it looks ugly and scary out there, Jesus is coming soon!

    • Indeed, Sumit, eschatology “reminds us to “look up” and have a heavenly or eternal perspective”. Truly, without such reminders, the temptation is there to view things and live as if this is the only life we have. As Christians, we do all we do, live this life and its trials with eternity in view.

    • I agree it is a great point to always remember that no matter what is going on around us or how chaotic everything may be God is sovereign and He is still on the throne, and He never changes He is the same today, yesterday, and will be the same forever. I can relate it is a great teaching to share with others who have anxiety about the future, I have to remind myself when I get anxious of the unknown or of everything around, God is in control and everything is going according to His plan. and nothing is getting Him off guard. I just need to trust and let the Spirit be my guide. Thanks for sharing Sumit.

    • Matt.24:4-8 NKJV “4And Jesus answered and said to them: “Take heed that no one deceives you. 5For many will come in My name, saying, ‘I am the Christ,’ and will deceive many. 6And you will hear of wars and rumors of wars. See that you are not troubled; for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet. 7For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. And there will be famines, pestilences, and earthquakes in various places. 8All these are the beginning of sorrows.”

    • Thanks for sharing Sumit, It is so true that no matter what is going on in the world, how chaotic it is, to always point others to the fact that God still reigns, and Hes sovereign and nothing catches Him off guard, He knows everything that’s going on. Helps when they are struggling with anxiety and fear of what’s going on and the future. I know for me looking at truth helps to calm my anxiety to know God is in control and He knows whats going on, and in the end everything is all for His glory.

  • Oh thank you Pastor Jeff! My favorite topic. And I too think eschatology and the biblical definition of the rapture is important as we disciple others but felt somewhat alone in that thinking. This was just so encouraging and validating! The bible is clear that the Rapture brings hope. Times right now need hope brought in but also as we disciple and counsel others hope is the medicine for whatever they may be going through.

    “The rapture is to prepare not to scare.” Getting an eternal perspective can pull the most self-focused person eyes off of self and onto God. Which always brings all troubles into perspective. I think of Job who had extreme troubles and when God finally speaks Job suddenly sees his horrific situation through God’s eyes and then Job is finally ready to shut his mouth and listen to understand God! That is the goal for ourselves and others to look to God and not let our experiences and or troubles discern our predicaments!!

    • I love your example of God’s dealings with Job; I recently studied through Job again and was impacted by the way God did not address any of Job’s direct questions or pains, but simply proclaimed His authority and power over creation. He is so far above our own reasonings and strifes. I agree completely with your enthusiasm concerning eschatology. It is all a part of setting our minds on things above and gaining hope through the knowledge of God’s ultimate control. When we see things happening, we look up!! Our redemption is drawing near.

    • I like that thing “prepare not to scare. Can we imagine living in the middle of this crazy world and all of the sudden in the twinkling of I eye finding ourselves in the presence of Christ preparing for the marriage supper.

    • Kendal, this is my favorite topic too. I see how learning about Eschatology brings hope to people, because God has told us about what is going to happen; therefore, we need not be surprise. At the end, we will be with God. How encouraging that is! God has everything under control, nothing surprises Him. Thanks for sharing Kendal.

    • Knowing that God is in control and that things are happening according to His timeline does bring peace and hope even in the difficult time which we find ourselves today. The rapture is something to look forward to and make sure we are prepared for, not something to fear. I know I have used the explanation of end times to speak with unbelievers about God. It is a great conversation starter for sure.

    • Great word Kendal! God does not give us the spirit of fear. I love how you said, “The bible is clear that the Rapture brings hope”. This is so true! Jesus is our blessed hope. As the world hopes on things that perish, our hope is eternal. Our focus should always be the kingdom.

  • I have witnessed within the past several months the deep impact that awareness of the end times has made on the members on my church, especially the youth. Instead of fear, hope and repentance have been produced. I recently had a conversation with one of the girls I help disciple where she expressed the worry and pressure she felt by the things happening in the world, but how that worry has been relieved through studying Revelation. I also witnessed the truth of 1 John 3:3; she fully repented and re-committed her life to the Lord in the wake of His coming and is now walking in purity!

    • Amen! The youth are hungry for the TRUTH and not false “truth” of the world. Our YG always has questions about the End Times and what it will look like. It is so important to guide them through Revelation so the Lord can blow them away and put a fire in their heart to live the rest of their short days for Him. We have one girl imparticular who severely struggled with anxiety, so much so that she was always on her phone so she didn’t have to make eye contact with anyone. She would often have panic attacks if the room was too crowded. After doing a small study of the book of Revelations with a group of the kids, her “worst fears” were faced as we read about the judgement of God. But she also learned that we are living in his grace period and grew in confidence in Him! She is a completely different person today knowing she is safe from the worst things, in God’s arms. Thank you for your post!

      • Such a glorious story Desiree! These very recent cultural changes have affected the teens in our youth group as well. One of my counselees described it as, “everyone seems so unsure of things these days.” What a great sign of, “the fields ripe for harvest.” We are seeing baptisms and the embracing the one and only Savior take a huge uptick. Just today I prayed with two women to accept by faith that Jesus is their only Savior. One Easter we had 36 baptisms on stage in the stock tank!

        • I love your perspective on how the uncertainty teens and youth feel these days is “being ripe for the harvest.” It is true, we should be redeeming the time and making Jesus known boldly because of it!

    • Liel, very excited to hear about the young lady at your church that you’re discipling, so encouraging! Only the Word of God working through the HolySpirit of God has the power to transform lives. So many of our youth and young adults are being actively deceived, “according to the prince of the power of the air” (Ephesians 2:2), via social media and news outlets. It is refreshing to know that God’s truth is alive and well, demolishing the works of the enemy. Blessings

    • You’re so blessed to be in a church that teaches Revelation Liel! You’ll be surprised how so many church pastors have been remiss on their obligation to teach on end times, as part of their calling and responsibility. All we hear are mostly, how to be debt free, how to be successful or how to have the best life now, instead of teaching on what is to come that would dictate one’s eternal destiny. This podcast has made us all aware, on our way to be Biblical Counselors, the urgent need to study Eschatology and use it, as the Lord leads, for His church.

      • Angelica you’re right about the church’s that do not teach Revelation, or they will reference a scripture here and there, thrown in to make a point about life’s many trials and tribulations.
        Over the course of several weeks, I threw in the suggestion box, the desire to learn and understand Revelation and the rapture of the church; our church called in two seminary students. These two young men, over the course of, I think it was 4 or 5 weeks, gave summaries that were similar to a book report; but in the end we knew nothing more than what we read in the book of Revelation itself. I was so disappointed that it caused me to look on the internet for various studies that would bring more clarity: I guess I was looking for biblical events that connect with today’s events, to help bring clarity.
        There are several media outlets that touch on the subject: prophecy watchers, Endtime ministries, David Heavener, and now I have recently found – Pastor Kessler’s To Every Man an Answer, and Pastor Kiddish’s Calvary Chapel Signal Hill.
        I found that because of the confusion that it causes by listening to the viewpoints of denominations that are not within the Calvary Chapel’s tier 2 beliefs, that confusion will absolutely come when there isn’t a solid foundation to a tier 2 and tier 3 belief. I don’t think I fully understand what Calvary Chapel’s tier 2 and 3 beliefs are, but I think I will ask Pastor Jeff in tomorrow’s zoom meeting.

        I don’t know about you, but I find myself becoming aggravated over churches teaching to make a person feel good rather than reading chapter’s in the Bible and discussing how this implies or relates to our life as it is supposed to be. I keep thinking about Jesus saying in Matthew 7:21-24 not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? and then willIi profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. therefore, whosoever heareth these saying of mine, and doeth them, i will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock. Some say that if we are trying to do what Jesus asks us to do, we’re being legalistic, and the only requirement is to believe, love God, and love others. Jesus taught so much, especially in the Sermon on the mount in Matt. 5. What do you think?

        • Hi Kristi! You ask the all important question here! I have a few bread crumbs to share because I failed greatly in this legalism thing.
          I’m one of those people that came to Christianity and exchanged my legalist faith for another set of beliefs which were just as legalistic because my heart likes control. I judged others who weren’t as hard working as I was in the Kingdom and even used the verse “work out your salvation with fear and trembling” when I wanted to exhort them. So what happened? I was told the remainder of that verse: “for it is God Who works in you to will and to do of His good pleasure.” Progressive Christianity is an apostate faith which has infiltrated the church since the 80s and is very captivating because it shames us into doing good works but—like the Pharisees—it doesn’t lift one finger to bear the burdens it places on its devotees. So what’s the difference? The difference is this–ministry is not what we do for God, ministry is what God does through us. He empowers what He requires. How do we know if we are empowered? The things we do are easy and light. We don’t get discouraged. We don’t look at others. We love our brothers and sisters in Christ no matter what they do or don’t do. And finally, we KNOW that we are KNOWN by God. 🙂

          • • Hi Carolyn, I appreciate every bit of bread, no matter the size, but this is hearty crumbs. Thank you for giving me something to ponder on. Just a response to what you said; I think I understand what your message is to me…
            I also came from a legalistic background; a Baptist church, and I also failed miserably. When I learned about true freedom in Christ, I was set free – indeed. But with growth, came more questions; many which were not answered and caused a sort of, bondage, from not knowing. I am one of those who just need to know, and continue to seek until I understand; unfortunately, I sought out answers in other denominations on eschatology that caused confusion and left more questions than answers.

            I’m thinking that your response was because of what I said, that pastors are teaching feel-good messages rather than the truth; I didn’t mean to imply that they should be teaching hellfire and brimstone—sorry if this was the implication. I just meant that there are pastor’s who are teaching more about quotations made by people, rather than reading a chapter or story in the Bible and relating it to our behavioral tendencies and why we need a savior. Line upon line, precept upon precept; this is not what I have been hearing for the last 10 years, and I’m aggravated because I go to church to hear a message from the Lord that would cause me look within, not a worldly message that makes me feel like the world followed me into church and makes me point fingers. I should be able to hear a message that doesn’t cause my mind to drift, but one that causes me to see the Lord and him speak to me. Occasionally I hear messages that are confirming things in my life that I have spoken to the Lord about, and on those days I truly rejoice and feel like I’ve learned something, or can carry with me into outreach/evangelism.

            Also, if the church is going to call in seminary students to teach on a specific subject, I would like to be able to say that I learned something from the teaching that the Bible doesn’t state; and that a seminary student has gotten insight because they have compared and contrasted it with the original text, or from other sources like historians like Josephus and such. I wasn’t trying to degrade them if that’s what it seemed like; I just felt like I could be candid so that I could hear what others are saying on the subject of eschatology and what each of us know, since there are too many teachings on it which differ dramatically from each other.

            Is, watching other people not do anything out of their gratefulness for salvation, legalism? I don’t know, but I don’t think so. I work diligently in order to be able to be effective at providing the Word to those whom we minister to, and know that many will reject it. That breaks my heart. I am against progressive Christianity, whom many that I encounter is for; someone I know in my family has been afflicted by this apostate teaching. One of my understandings of progressivism is the acceptance of homosexual sin, and all sin; but Jesus said, go and sin no more lest a worst thing happen (John 5 & 8). If we realize that we have sinned, we have a loving father who will forgive us if we confess it; progressivism says that we can sin because the Lord knows that we were born into sin and we can’t help it and is why Jesus was sent to die on the cross. The question here is: are they our brother and sister in Christ if they have not accepted Jesus? I believe not. I believe they are separate from Jesus, therefore separate from us if they reject salvation, but are those who we must lead to the truth. Progressivism also says that all people are saved no matter if they confess their sins, and is why Jesus went to the cross. I believe that the sheep and the goats are the people who have and have not accepted Jesus, and progressivism is a lie.

            Our ministry is truly what helps me to hold onto my walk with Jesus, and causes me to want to know more of Him; a deeper understanding, a deeper relationship, the cause for my continual search and prayer and hope. I realize that once we have asked for forgiveness, we are sealed and do not “lose” our salvation, but we are capable of walking away from it when our desire to sin becomes dominant (John 6:66). Once when I was first attending a church in PA as a new convert, the pastor asked us all to close our eyes and focus on the Lord Jesus, and wait on the Lord; I asked for Him to come and fill me, and it was at that moment that He gave me a vision. The vision was my full name being written out in a beautiful gold scripting in the book of life. I watched it being written. It was that moment that I had an appreciation and understanding that I was going to be with Him in the end, and it was that moment that my desire to work for Him (as a fisher of men) sparked. His pleasure in my life is what I look forward to seeing and experience often. That desire is just as strong now as it was then. So I see our walk as one that serves the Lord faithfully, going forth to make disciples of all nations, baptizing in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit, and continually growing in knowing Him through prayer, and His Word, and with each other talking about these things as we are and as we do in these podcasts.
            Blessings to you, and thank you for your response

          • Hi Carolyn. I really enjoyed reading your comment and specifically was encouraged by the comment that ministry is not what we can do for God but what God can do through us. It is refreshing and true and lifts burdens off our shoulders knowing it is God who does and wills for his good pleasure. Also that he is the author and finisher of our faith and if we put our trust in him he will bring us to completion.

          • I like that “ministry is not what we do for God, it is what God does through us.” If everyone would rely on this definition of ministry, God could get more done through us. May God empower each of us for his work through us. Amen

        • I also would like to learn more about the book of Revelations. However, as a prospect, it seems like a difficult book to understand. I can remember when I had just surrender my life to Christ. I when to a church where they really emphasize the book of revelation. it seemed like an open door to a debate about who had it right. It was all really confusing to me and odd.

          • When I first began to study Revelation I was taken back to the book of Daniel and the statue, and who each of these kingdoms were. I learned who they are today and I’m able to see predictive prophecy unfold by news reports; only, Christian news sources are the only truthtellers today it seems. Anything other than the relationship between Revelation and Daniel I’m unaware and would like to learn further. It’s interesting and we’re supposed to learn it. I can’t wait for Pastor Jeff’s writing on it. BLB.org has commentaries on Revelation that I recently found written by C.C. Pastors and worth checking out too.

    • This is so encouraging to hear. I haven’t experienced that yet. I so want to be able to present it in a way that brings hope. Not the doom and gloom that I have experienced it taught. Thank-you Liel

    • Thank you for sharing,
      it is refreshing when pastors speak the truth how it is in the bible and not dilute to appeal to the masses in fear of losing.
      When we are taught in this matter prosperity gospel takes place and we begin a legalistic faith and almost sort of treat God like an ATM.
      Thank you for sharing and God Bless this church that is stepping up to the challenge

    • Hi Liel, this is happening throughout the body of Christ. So many youths wanting answers and seeking comfort about all the craziness in the world. By keeping these truths away from them is only causing more hurt and pain. It is crucial for us that are “older in Christ” to be willing and equipped to share and teach about Eschatology. Just like the young lady you shared about how it brought relief to her and caused her to re-commited her life to Christ, this to will happen to those that hear about God’s goodness and love for the world. Thank you for sharing. Blessings!

    • Very encouraging to hear Liel, of the impact eschatology is having on the youths in your church. God always has His way with people and knows how to reach each natural group. Contrary to what has become the norm that youths are not responding to the gospel, your testimony is an encouragement. Praise to the Almighty God.

    • This is so very encouraging! It is awesome seeing the younger generation taking up their crosses and following the LORD! Your post reminded me of the Scripture found in Acts! Acts 2:17-21 NKJV “17‘And it shall come to pass in the last days, says God,
      That I will pour out of My Spirit on all flesh;
      Your sons and your daughters shall prophesy,
      Your young men shall see visions,
      Your old men shall dream dreams.
      18And on My menservants and on My maidservants
      I will pour out My Spirit in those days;
      And they shall prophesy.
      19I will show wonders in heaven above
      And signs in the earth beneath:
      Blood and fire and vapor of smoke.
      20The sun shall be turned into darkness,
      And the moon into blood,
      Before the coming of the great and awesome day of the Lord.
      21And it shall come to pass
      That whoever calls on the name of the Lord
      Shall be saved.”

  • Last year when covid hit my Pastor decided to do a lengthy series on eschatology. He normally teaches verse by verse, chapter by chapter, book by book, but he sensed the sheep getting very skittish because of all the effects of the shut downs. It was a very timely series and seemed to have a calming affect on the body. It was just so comforting to hear a steady voice telling us that God is in control, and this is all in His own plan. It really encouraged me to help others get the right perspective when they were alarmed by current events. God is in control is a very calming truth to hear when things get ruff.

    • How appropriate for your pastor to do so. Definitely Holy Spirit lead. We need to be reminded about the assurance we have in Christ, especially now. It can be easy to listen more to what is going on in the world with politics and foreign affairs to where all we are hearing is the noise of the world instead of the peaceful streams of the Holy Spirit teaching us and guiding us through it.

    • Harry, glad to hear about how your pastor was prompted to teach on eschatology during the chaos of the pandemic. As you said, it is indeed ” so comforting to hear a steady voice telling us that God is in control, and this is all in His own plan”. God sees the beginning from the end, He is the alpha and the omega, and therefore no news should have the power to consume us with fear, no matter how unsettling it may be. God isn’t up in heaven scratching His head wondering how He is going to handle what’s going on down here on earth. He already knows, we just have to keep our eyes fixed on the Lord and trust Him.

    • What a wise and caring pastor you have! It was my first thought, when this all started and all the churches shut up I thought what are they doing, why are they not instructing the people on what is happening and reassuring them. In my spirit I was compelled to go deeper with the Lord in understanding bible prophecy. I am grateful for pastors and teacher who were compelled by Christ to bring this hope during this past year. Too many just shut up in a time when they needed to speak up. This year has drove many of us to lean in harder and listen to the Holy Spirit, to cuddle up closer to our Savior and to search deeper into the mysteries of God. Prophecy explains so much of what is happening right now and it brings comfort and a blessed hope. It reminds us God is in control, all is going according to plan and at the end is victory. If all people knew how the story ends they would be courage and brave instead of so afraid.

    • Harry I’m so very happy that your pastor decided to do a lengthy series on eschatology; this is deep on my heart and my desire to understand is, also. This is something that we all need to hear, and be reminded of in the midst of turmoil – God Is In Control, He is aware, He is here with us going through this with us, and it is all within his plan of salvation and if we just wait a while longer we will be delivered from this day of evil. These are the truths that we can share with our counselees, even when we don’t fully understand.

    • Harry, such a timely teaching last year! The world went crazy, seemingly all at once, and people were absolutely scared. During times like these, the voice of a man (or woman) who is steadfast in their faith and knowledgeable in Scripture is like a lifeboat for a drowning man. I pray that we will all be that voice!

  • I was hoping for a sequel to the talk on practical questions for counseling conflicts but this was an exciting topic nonetheless! I do agree that understanding the end times prophecies does make a difference in how we live now! We need to look up and understand that Jesus could return for His church at any moment. This infuses our lives with hope and gives us a perspective that helps us understand that whatever we are facing here on earth could pass away rather quickly! We shouldn’t get too bogged down in ourselves. God’s plans are unfolding. We want to be ready for His return and busy doing His work of sharing Him with the world around us. With all the craziness unfolding, we can be certain He is on the throne and in charge. Things are getting so bad. Lord Jesus, please use Pastor Jeff to write this back on eschatology in the counseling office! Continue to use Him as a powerful witness for You and help him to make an impact on the biblical counseling movement in the ways that You see fit. Show him when you want him to work on this endeavor and give him the words to express the message you have for him. In Jesus’ Mighty Name I pray! Amen

  • It’s encouraging to be reminded too of the special blessing for those that study Revelation. Chapter 1, verse 3 says, “Blessed is he who READS and those who HEAR the words of the prophecy, and HEED the things which are written in it; for the time is near.” Pastor Jeff pointed this out and I can honestly say I had not seen it before. I knew there was a blessing to those who read it but tonight the Holy Spirit is showing me clearly that it’s not just reading it..we must actually hear it (take it to heart) and live by it!! I like how Pastor Jeff explained that we need to rely on the Holy Spirit as we bring up eschatology as we are meeting with people. There is no special formula as to when we should bring it up. No set pattern. We can rely on the Lord as to when to discuss these things. A great reminder of how important it is. I often use a discipleship study when I am meeting with newer believers called Biblical Principles for a Strong Foundation by Craig Caster. The last lesson of the study is on the End Times.

  • I hadn’t really put these two things together before. But I can see the logical sense. In speaking with people who are upset about what is happening in our county and world, I remind them that God knows what is happening, and He is in control. They are full of anxiety about the crumbling of society, and how everything is turned inside out right now. People are polarizing in a way that I have never seen before (and I’m not young). There was time when Christians were held in esteem, but now the word ‘Christian’ has become a term of contention. This has caused a great deal of fear for some Christians, and it has pushed them out of the comfort zone of what being a Christian always ‘meant’ before. One of the saddest things we have witnessed lately is how so many churches/pastors/leaders are trying to straddle the fence so as to not offend the masses, but still keeping the ‘Christian label.’ I think this is a result of not trusting that God is absolutely still on His throne and aware – and to be very bold, I will say that I think this may be separating those who truly believe and those were simply comfortable with the Christian moniker and lifestyle.
    I am grateful for this podcast. It is very timely and needed. May God give us all the needed wisdom and words when helping our brothers and sisters who are trying to deal with this fear.

  • Thank you, Pastor Jeff, for bringing this issue of Eschatology into the Counseling perspective. It does bring a very refreshing outlook on the importance of our future salvation to our present conduct for both the counselor and the counselee.
    As believers, the scripture rightly says, if in this life only we have hope in Christ, then we are of all men most miserable (1 Corinthians 15:19). Our Christianity does not only have earthly values, there is also the reality of eternal life with Christ.
    Eschatology not only offers future hope for the believer but also tells us God is in control of all that is happening in the world. And for both counselor and counselee, this hope of a future reality gives us guidance on how we should live for Him (1 John 3:3). When we have confidence in our final destination, we can follow Christ with unwavering dedication no matter what we face in this life.
    The challenges we face should not distract us from focusing on our ultimate salvation, but rather prepare us for it; and it is a good thing as counselors to be assured of this and to also pass it on to our counselees, it may give them a new way of looking at the issues in their lives.

    • I never really gave the end times much thought. But I like what you have mentioned from 1 Corinthians 15. Where through the verses it explains that if Christ did not raise, our faith is meaningless, but verse 20 “But Christ has indeed been raised from the dead. . .” and what a hope it is to have, our faith in not meaningless, and our ruler is in heaven with all authority over His enemies.
      Final Destination is a movie series, in short: An event is to take place where some people are destined to die, but when some of them escape the event, their lives are slowly taken by Death in unique ways. It caught my eyes when you mentioned “we have confidence in our final destination” it got me to think, that even if I were to die in some random freak accident, it wouldn’t be an accident in God’s eyes and I am confident that I would be with God in His Kingdom. It really does give me a new perspective, not to worry, and not to be afraid.

      • That is really true, one way to look at it is it is never really a final destination for us. Just something to look forward to in a time when the world is looking so dark.
        It does give us a confidence and a love that we can share with other people that are just not confident at all. Times seem so awful but God is always in control.

      • Hi Kayla. I am glad our ‘final destination’ is so much more wonderful than that series! We have the assurance and the blessed hope of eternity with Christ. The hopelessness in those movies is indicative of what we are seeing all around us – people living in fear of the future (and the present). And the fear does not just touch the lives of the non-Christian, but, sadly, many Christians as well.

    • Well said Songo! Reminding one another (as we all need to be reminded “ When we have confidence in our final destination, we can follow Christ with unwavering dedication no matter what we face in this life.” There is hope in Christ because He is the God of hope- we need to take our eyes off of our circumstances. We know the truth, may we all have the boldness to say it, with the love of Christ

    • thank you Songo Ambie-Barango for your comment. It was a great reminder of our future Salvation into the kingdom of God. Also about the hope we should have in this life. Because eschatology clearly tells us that God is in control. This is all hope in how we should live, being confident in our final destination. As we face our trial its God preparing us for the final destination for those who chose to draw closer to internal living.

    • Amen, Songo! If we don’t agree on how the prophecies will come about, we can agree that whatever takes place will be completely in God’s plan and under complete control by Him! I also believe that as these things happen we will understand more fully the prophetic and it will help us understand more clearly the things still to happen.

  • This podcast was extremely helpful and comforting. Before, I never thought about eschatology in regards to Biblical Counseling. Now I understand why it is so important to really know what your believe and how that affects how we counsel.
    Going into a counseling situation, a specially a difficult one, with a heavenly mindset that God is in control and the outcome is in God’s hands takes a load off of our part in the situation. Of course we always need to rely on the Holy Spirit and be diligent in prayer but sometimes we walk away from a conversation wondering if we could’ve said things better or said something more. With this mindset we don’t have to dwell on those things.
    As the Bible says we shouldn’t be surprised by the trials that are to come, no matter how awful they are. God says that we as believers will face trials and that the world is only going to get worse. So instead of being distraught and downcast about every trial we or others go through, we can approach them with confidence in the Lord knowing that he is working and “carrying his good works out unto completion.” Even when we cannot see him working.

    • Wondering if I could have said something better has struck me a few times. I appreciate your comment to remind me that God will bring about His will. I forget to think Heaven-ward, to remember the eternal glory that awaits in heaven, and I have been learning recently to remember that our end goal is to bring Glory to God.
      John 16:33 “I have told you these things, so that in me you may have peace. In this world you will have trouble. But take heart! I have overcome the world.”
      Jesus has overcome the world and that is something very dear to me, knowing that I don’t have to rely on anything of my own powers, because God has already overcome this world, I am free in His peace, especially when the trials of this life are thorns in my side.

    • I am amazed at the comfort God gives in those times when we thought maybe we should have said something different or said more or less than we did. It is a good reminder to know God is in control. He promises to give us the words we need to speak. We can rest knowing that God allows us to go through every circumstance we find ourselves in and He will use it for His purpose and our good.

    • Well said, Desiree! I think that after almost every counseling/discipleship situation I engage in, I walk away wondering whether all I said was correct or inspired. I often walk away with a sense of, “Wow God thank you so much for using me!” But intermingled with that is often nagging doubts too. But this heavenly mindset is such a great tool to help me keep things in the right perspective. It shifts my focus from self to the Lord.

  • I absolutely loved this podcast. I find it very interesting. The teachings of end times included in biblical counseling are fascinating to me. I see how somebody could get scared and maybe not be able to go to sleep by learning what is going to happen in the future. But again we counsel to people within the church. I see why Pastor Jeff says we need to be spirit lead. The Lord will let us know when and to who we should bring this teachings about the end times too. I personally find it very hopeful and delivers comfort knowing that whatever we are going through is temporary.
    Also, seeing what is happening in our society is of no surprise. It is going accordingly to what the bible says. This knowledge makes me even be a better christian.

    I found a diagram in this podcast about the Resurrections and Judgements. Including “The underworld”. In case you want to see it click on 1 Thessalonians 4 on this podcast. Then click on “More” at the end of the verse. After that, click on “tool” for 1 Th 4:17. Then “Commentaries” and finally “Dispensational Truth XVII. The Judgements.

  • The world has become scary. It was just last year I learned not to trust anything anyone says, unless it comes right from evidence of their own life, or the Scriptures. I am becoming more inclined to purchase a gun, and more convinced to live a “homestead” life where I can grow food on my own land.
    I have also learned that God’s Word is the only solid I can trust and rely on to tell me the truth, and I am thankful for this podcast to remind me to take in account the prophecies of the end times. I can’t say for sure if this is the true end times, it could be years and years from now, or it could happen in a few months.
    The points to remember are, as emphasized by Jeff: Remember God is in Control; Hold a Heavenly Perspective; and Bring about Purity. These end times are not a reflection of terror and horror, but of God’s great power to restore. We can have confidence in God to bring about His good will, to live in His mercy as our refuge, to hold onto the Eternal promise in Christ, and have peace which transcends understanding. I can always trust that God will bring about His will, for His glory, no matter where the dominos fall.

  • The second point of knowing and understanding the end times giving us a heavenly perspective stood out to me. I know when my kids have struggled with something I have often asked them, “in light of eternity, how important is it that…” (…Your hair is in a perfect ponytail, your outfit is just right, or you win this argument). Is it more important to argue a point with someone or point them to Jesus?

    As pastor Jeff said often God allows us to go through something so that we can minister to others who go through the same thing. I have found this to be very true in my own life. One example was having the fuel pump go out on an old car and then happening upon a couple having the same issue, while they were traveling for a job interview. Through my experience, God allowed me to minister to them and provided a way for them to make it to the interview on time.

    It reminds me of 2 Corinthians 1:3-4 “Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of mercies and God of all comfort, who comforts us in all our affliction so that we will be able to comfort those who are in any affliction with the comfort with which we ourselves are comforted by God.”

    • Same here Doneen! The heavenly perspective found in the study of Eschatology makes the relevant, irrelevant after all. It brings us to the real ‘reality’ which is ours in Jesus Christ. Study of the end times helps us focus on what really matters – ‘point our children to Jesus,’ as you said, or – ‘argue a useless point,’ helping us to live each day for others, as God intended.

  • I never realized just how much Eschatology was very much part of counseling. The fact that we need to know what is ahead in order to phase what is present makes so much sense. It shouldn’t take us finding ourselves flat on our backs and nowhere left to turn, to finally look up and look to His glory and grace. I love that the revelation of His wrath and what is to come is “not to scare us, but prepare us”. That is His love. His wrath is a just and righteous wrath, and is good as He is good. If we can’t bring others to see beyond their short sighted, short minded thinking, than they will be stuck in what feels like an inescapable circumstance or situation. Nothin on this earth we endure, go through, or that is withheld from us, is forever, it is all but a vapor. To not be able to live and live set apart because of all that is fleeting, has been magnified through this Podcast today. Thank you for challenging, correcting, and convicting me to want to grasp the end times and all that it tells me of who God is and where it is I want to be.

  • I am always so amazed at God’s timing. This was one of my favorite lessons. I love the book of Revelation, it is one of my favorite books to study. I was talking to my Mom, she does not have the same beliefs so I am always trying to gently teach her truths. She and I got on the subject of the Rapture. I started telling her how I was looking forward to it and that all of the signs are in front of us. I love my Mom, but she is goofy. My Mom said, it is only going to worse. Then said we would be here for the seven years of tribulation. I felt myself getting defensive and then realized, this is everything I have been learning. It’s not about me. I took a breath and started trying to teach. She wasn’t having it. She was making disappointed sounds as if I was the one that was wrong.
    I thought about the tier and realized, she still believes in Christ and she isn’t going to loose her salvation because she is confused and through time and seeds I will bring her the rest of the way to the light.
    Once again Pastor Jeff, thank you for the wonderful blessed teachings and I look forward to your book about Eschatology in Biblical Counseling. I see the need to look forward to the rapture and living for Christ.
    Blessing everyone.

  • Finally! Someone is addressing the urgency in knowing these things! Thank you Pastor Jeff! I’m truly blessed in this class that teaches us how to be genuine Biblical Counselors who will provide the ultimate ‘soul care’ relevant from the here and now to eternity.
    This podcast comes as answered prayer for me, as I’ve been prompted lately to scout for a church that teaches eschatology instead of the usual ‘how to have your best life now’ type of preachings. Studying end time prophesies, as Pastor Jeff pointed out, gives us not only the blessed hope and assurance we need as we go on in a world that calls evil good and good evil, but also serves as a great reminder, ‘to make our calling and election sure,’ as admonished in 2 Peter 1:10, and a motivation to ‘conduct ourselves in a manner worthy of the Gospel,’ in Philippians 1:27.
    There is no weariness as we live holy lives in expectation of what is to come.

    • Amen Sister! I loved all that you shared here. I resonate with what Pastor jess says as well, as the counselors of God we are the ones whose work is Soul Care. Every church in the world should be teaching Bible Prophecy right now, it is exactly what the masses need to learn in order to be prepared what is to come and to give them the comfort and hope to soldier on. I love the admonishment and it is a good reminder to us, as we are the light now for the dark and lost world, to conduct ourselves in a manner worthy of the Gospel.

    • “There is no weariness as we live holy lives in expectation of what is to come.”
      I like that and that is so true. Knowing what is to come guides our hearts and minds into a realization that God is sovereign, that God is the Great I Am! I am sufficient, I am everything that you could ever possible want or need. That is my God and that is the God that people need to be alive and truly live in this world.

    • I feel the same way, this podcast was such a breathe of fresh air. To know that scriptures are to “reveal and not conceal” and “is put into plain sight”, shows that these truths are to be taught and not hidden or to shy away from because of the fear causing division within the body of Christ. Truth is truth and it will set you free. thanks for sharing. Blessings!

      • YES – “reveal and not conceal” is a great way to address all points of the scripture. I believe that each one of us is in process and therefore why we are able to hear the same Living Word and receive different things from it in application to our need for counsel. God is so great to meet us all where we are.

    • I think this “having your best life now” that you referred to in your comment is so true, as to what people are preaching, as well as what people are seeking. But this is not going to give us a heavenly mind set. This kind of teaching is not going to reveal who God truly is, why He sent His son, and why He is coming back for us. IF we had this in the forefront of our minds and hearts, then what we do, how we do it, and in the manner which we do it, would look differently. I think what this would also give us a sense of urgency in getting the gospel out and living our life set apart, as we should be.

    • Thanks for sharing Angelica. I agree on the importance of pastors teaching on eschatology in church and not just teaching on how to have your best life. I am blessed to have a Pastor that not only teaching on it but reminds us not to fear it. We will not grow weary if we are educated on what is to come because we will not fear we will learn to trust in God and His promises and also that He is in control

    • Interesting that as important as eschatology is to understand the times we live in, it is not easy-to-present teaching that all agree upon! Pre-tribulation, post-tribulation, etc. Is the Church removed and the Jewish believers left to evangelize? Do we all stay through the tribulation, protected from the outpouring of God’s wrath like Israel was in Goshen while Egypt was experiencing the plagues? Who are the two witnesses? How about the 144,000? I have read so many interpretations of these things over the years that I can understand why so many pastors shy away from taking a firm position on much of it!

  • We are here to remind people gently to Look Up. To remember they have a Savior who is coming for them. We are here to share the end of the story with them. As I was listening to the podcast I wonder how many really know that we are in the midst of a Spiritual War. When I speak to family members who say they have a relationship with God and I talk about prophecy and share God’s word from Isaiah or Revelation they do not know how the story ends. I would dare to say that most people if they read the Bible at all (only 1 in 6 believers do) avoid the Old Testament and Revelation. The enemy knows the transformative power of bible prophecy, to see who gets the victory, to see he blessed hope we have when we have a heavenly perspective and know God is in control.
    Right now with churches shutting up instead of doubling down on the true of what is happening in the world today, I can understand why the people are afraid. the very ones who should know God is in control, are instead putting their trust in man. We are here for such a time as this and God is making ready the army of God. He is calling to remembrance that our redemption draws near, that we know neither the time or the hour, and it is precipitating purity, as Pastor Jeff said. As the counsel of God it is our mission to comfort the people to remind them that God is still in control, that this is all part of the plan, as crazy as it is. To remind them that Jesus is the Hope of Heaven and it is time to get ready because He is coming back, there is going to be a final battle and the Earth will one day be free from the curse of death and the reign of Satan.

    • I agree Christi, it is important to remind people that we know the end of the story. God gave us Revelation for a reason. It’s not there for us to just ignore. Knowing that Christ is ultimately victorious should change the way we live today in the midst of our spiritual battles.

  • When I saw the title for this podcast, I must say I was a bit confused! Eschatology in relation to counseling? But I was so encouraged listening to pastor Jeff spur us on to apply what we believe about Jesus coming back to everyday counseling situations. Now more than ever, I see a need to comfort people with the truth that Jesus is not only completely aware of all that we are going through, but He is also coming back for us, His church. The world is so incredibly scary; and the fact that at the click of a button, we have access to read about all the horrors that are going on everywhere…. we really need that hope that we are not appointed to wrath. There will be a time when God says, “Enough”, and returns for us. I hope to use this in counseling situations as a way to encourage people who are overwhelmed with the anxiety and evils of the world. God knows, He is in complete control, He has a plan, and we can have HOPE in the midst of everything. We can encourage one another to LOOK UP instead of focusing on the troubles around us.

    • I was confused as well! The point of eschatology in counseling is not one I had heard before but like you I was very encouraged by this podcast. This past week there was a tragedy in my home town and I was able to point some of the people who were affected to the hope found in Revelation.

    • Amen, Rachel. Yes, I also was surprised by the title of this podcast for biblical counseling but it makes perfect sense. We are living in the end times and God’s Word says it would be like this. We are to give an account for the hope that is within us. A big part of that hope is when we see the signs of the end and understand the birth pangs of the earth, we are to “lift our head because our redemption is nigh”. Praise the Lord!

  • Knowing what is going to happen in the future does help us to see that God is in control. Sometimes that is hard to remember with the situations that we find ourselves in. For instance, right now my family is going through a covid illness, my daughter and I are on the mends but my wife was put on a ventilator yesterday. (I would appreciate your prayers) I have read and studied the book of Revelation and I know what will happen in the end. God Wins! and we who are in Christ win with him. If I did not know God and know that he is in control of all things, I would not be in a good place right now. Through my reading and study of the word of God, I know that she is in his hands and no matter which way this ends up, God is in control and his will be done. My hope and the hope of my wife and my family are in Jesus Christ, the Savior of all who come to him. Amen

    I have counseled many people going through illness or loss of loved ones, but now I have a very real understanding of what they were and will be going through. I will have a greater compassion for those in need because of what I am going through right now and will be able to share with them not just to them. God blesses in every situation, in every way possible. To God be the Glory for the great things he has done and will do, Amen.

    • You and your wife are in my prayers James; I just prayed Psalm 119 with your wife in mind. I am praying comfort, understanding and wisdom for you during this time of tribulation and suffering. I’m sorry that you’re dealing with this while trying to do your studies, and truly praying for your wife’s complete recovery.

    • James, May the grace and mercy of the Lord overwhelm you and your family at this time, strengthen and comfort you through this trying period.

  • This past year has been such a great reminder of WHY I counsel/disciple people, I cannot tell you how often people are consoled by the simple truth that there is always hope in Christ. It is so necessary to be reminded of this and to remind others of this. Hope in Christ changes everything, whether the person is a brand new believer or someone who is going through a weathered trial. Keeping an eternal perspective through trials, especially when it seems like the worlds gone mad- that changes how we cope with the situation and the testimony that we have during the trial.

  • What a great perspective that comes from an amazing book in the Bible that demonstrates love and not fear. The end of times is not worldly fear but redemption time where God’s people celebrate the coming of Christ. I enjoy that we can discuss this freely because it is urgent to repent and seek Him, counseling with this in mind will break a lot of confused minds. we are to be bold when we are teaching, correcting and reproofing someone but always in love and meekness, but we cannot dilute the truth it must be told as God meant it.
    Thank you so much Pastor for this episode it is refreshing

  • When I accepted the Lord in 1990, the church did not shy away from End Time teachings (Eschatologhy). It was one of the Bible study’s I studied in depth and found myself being filled with hope and assurance about how much God loves His children and creation. In the last few decades the church has moved away from teaching this crucial wisdom and knowledge. I believe because of this it has brought much fear, anxiety, and lies about the character of God. I am in agreement that this should be brought into the counseling table to help care for those who are in need of knowing that God has everything under control. I think I’m going to take a refresher course on End Times and start looking up to the heavens. 🙂

    • Wow! When I first read your post, my remembrance was when Jesus turned the water to wine.
      At the beginning of the wedding the best wine is first served, then when the guests are unsuspecting, the cheaper wine is then served; but, Jesus’s wine was even better than the first. This makes me think of the book of Revelation like the better wine of Jesus; his return will be the greatest out of the entire Bible.

      Your example was how Eschatology was taught, which brought hope and assurance about how much God loves us (the greater wine always); but then the teaching’s drifted away from Eschatology, bringing much fear, anxiety and lies about the character of God (the wine was cheap and the people were unsuspecting). I’m not saying that your pastor is not a godly man, please don’t think that. I was just looking at the big picture, and how changing the format of the message or how its delivered or what the people took in their hearts to carry out His will, could cause a falling away. My question to myself was: Is this part of the cause of the great falling away? God forbid that we cause it because our ears are being tickled, while we sit in our chairs and not go out and lead others to salvation. I certainly don’t want to be the cause of that to happen; but one who leads others to Jesus.

    • I love that Jeff’s talk gave you a desire to delve back into the end times Michelle. Chuck Missler was so passionate about the end times. I went to Israel with he and his wife, Nan and he taught so in depth during that trip that I felt engorged with Scripture. God Bless as you deep dive into the Word sister.

    • I am in agreement with you, Michelle! When I returned to the Lord, it was through a Revelation seminar. I was thrilled to finally be able to understand crucial biblical prophecy and end times teaching. I also feel that I need to dig deeper into these teachings as well. I feel it’s vital to witness these things to this younger generation. It’s important so that they can make sense of the chaos going on in this present age and find comfort that God is in control. He knows the end from the beginning.

  • I am so glad that Pastor Jeff touched this subject because this is one of the reasons that I wanted to attend a Christian University; Eschatology. I have always been intrigued by all that the Bible teaches, before I knew about the Bible.

    When I was a little one, in my household, my mother had so many different books. Dictionaries, thesauruses, and many books of knowledge including the book of Nostradamus, but not the Bible. Every time I had a question, she wouldn’t explain anything, but tell me to go look it up; but the language was so complex that I couldn’t comprehend it. I believed that I was truly unintelligent, and would never be as smart as everyone else. When I finally did get my hands on a King James Bible, I didn’t understand the Old English and never read the bible again until other print’s came out that was easier to read and comprehend. I don’t have a learning disability, it was just environmental factors that caused me to pay attention to surroundings as a priority.
    I believe that the Lord understands our struggles with understanding, and allowed other print’s of the Bible so that those who were like me, would begin to pay attention to His Words rather than the words of the world. This includes the book of Daniel and Revelation; however, I still feel dumb. I’ve read both, and am reading Revelation again (currently on chapter 17), and understand what both are saying. I understand Daniel and his vision, and how the statue relates to kingdoms of the world that are today in existence; and I understand Revelation’s trumpets, bowls and vials and what each represent. I sort of see that there is a relationship between the kingdoms in Daniel, and the trumpets, bowls and vials; maybe this is the mystery, but maybe other people understand it better, I don’t know. But when I first began to study those books, it seemed as if everyone had a different view, and each seemed valid; over the quarantine I began to search for studies and heard so many that my view, I believe, is skewed. I need a deeper understanding, and happy that Pastor Jeff touched on this. Since Calvary Chapel teaches, line-upon-line and precept-upon-precept, I look very forward to reading his book! So many people pick and choose scriptures, put them together in a way that seems to make sense.

    I once fully believed in the pre-tribulation rapture, but then after learning other views, I feel that a mid-trib rapture makes sense. Because we are not subject to the wrath of God, many are saying that the first 3.5 years is the wrath of satan, and we are not promised to be without tribulation. Then I heard the Pentecostals call the middle of the tribulation the post-trib rapture for the same reason. Ugh! …in confusion, give me knowledge Lord, and move it from my head to my heart in complete understanding.

    I really hope that Pastor Jeff’s book becomes a study, because I’d be the first to sign up. If I’m confused, how can I keep others from being confused other than to avoid the subject?

  • There is a man who attends our church who lost his wife last year to a pedestrian accident on a highway near to where we live in our area. I was at that scene after that accident. It was horrific. Since then, every day is a life of devastation for him. He and his family will never recover over the physical loss of their wife and mother but still, each one has peace in God which surpasses all reasoning because she is with the Lord, and they know it.

    He also attends our weekly men’s morning study and before class (this morning), and I asked him how he was, knowing the answers he gives always center on his loss. What I found to be very timely in listening to our podcast today, was how I was able to respond to him, to which he agreed, that he would see his beloved wife once again!

    I told him in how our world is turning lately, he may not have long to wait before he sees her. It lit a light of hope in his spirit as we discussed the rapture of the Church and our coming changes Jesus promises to His bride.

    For this man, the rapture is indeed his 2nd-Tier Doctrine and the tragedy he lives with, is actually a testimony to the trial which brings him to strong empathy in which others may face. No one could argue that he can confidently minister to them through the peril he himself has endured. His testimony of faith is strong even in the middle of what he lives with every day until the Lord calls him home – whether that happens as an individual or corporately.

    • All I can say to this is — Wow! The belief in Jesus in someone is expressed when their countenance changes from sadness, to a light, knowing that they will be reunited with their loved one soon. That is victory in a counseling situation!

      • I know he is anxious to see his bride again, yet knowing no one is married in Heaven, he believes he will see her again!

    • Wow, this is really beautiful and compelling Sam. I am encouraged by how you applied Jeff’s talk with a personal relationship in your life with someone whom you want to minister to. You have the opportunity to speak words of life into this man’s heart and soul. May the Lord Bless you!

      • Thank you for your encouraging words. I know it has opened up a closeness between him and me, and for others’ benefit too. What a strange thing to say when this was so horrible but only God can use his situation for others’ good.

    • Praise God, Sam for such a timely counsel to a hurting person. The Bible says we should comfort one another with the assurance of the coming of the Lord, so we do not sorrow concerning our loved ones which are asleep. I pray that he remains strong in the Lord, and also use his testimony to comfort others.

      • I do wish I could do more for him, but I must believe God has a wonderful plan in store in the midst of this tragedy. It is helping someone for sure.

  • While I stand strong in my personal interpretation of Revelation and End Times, I am open to receiving other’s viewpoints and beliefs. Before I discuss Eschatology with anyone I feel it is important to declare that perspective and process play a large role in one’s interpretation; of one’s counsel, the book or Revelation or otherwise. With that being said when I review my thoughts on the biblical teaching of End Times, the Book of Revelation or delve into Eschatology I will always start in the book of Genesis and maintain it hand in hand with the teachings of Revelation. Genesis is a type of biblical security blanket for the stark dosing that Revelation can offer and the two in tandem seem to make the whole more palatable. My baseline for this being Genesis 28:15 “And, behold, I am with thee, and will keep thee in all places whither thou goest, and will bring thee again into this land; for I will not leave thee, until I have done that which I have spoken to thee of.” Starting with this promise, as a baseline, instills a solid anchor for one to be sure in while they explore the seemingly doom & gloom of the book of Revelation and the prophesy of End Times. While I understand, via this podcast episode, that Pastor Jeff feels that Eschatology has a place in biblical counseling, I do not buy freely into this same train of thought. If this is the case then I agree only if the teaching of Revelation is offered with the framework of Genesis. With this pairing I feel it is effective to establish the correct balance that one needs to firmly stand in either book’s full understanding. To me, in order to determine Eschatology’s position in Biblical counseling further variables should be explored, and are unique to each counselling session…the operative word here being variables. Each person seeking counsel brings with them a unique set of variables mainly their current state of mind, emotional state/stability and frame of reference.
    What is their spiritual starting point, how long have they been a Christian, how was their foundation built and what is it’s present condition? While I agree that Eschatology does have a valid place within Biblical Counseling, I agree with limits and variables attached. When it is explored in a biblical counseling setting, the delivery should maintain a positive slant and, like God’s love, and be firm yet full of grace. After all He is the beginning (Genesis 1:1) and the end (Revelation 21:6). His timing is perfect, no matter when the End comes, I can take heart in knowing that He is a just, loving God who is true to His promises and that the Shepherd will never abandon his sheep.

  • Such an important topic for counseling! After the election results came in last November, I ended up doing a lot of post-election trauma sessions! Many are still unwavering in their belief that what they prayed for will soon come to pass. You are so right Jeff that a misunderstanding of what God will allow to come in this earth has set folks up for wrestling with what faith is and how we come along-side what He is allowing. There’s a parable that I use a lot lately. It’s the one about the wheat and the tares. It’s very instructive: “don’t pull up the tares lest you pull up some of the wheat with them. Rather, let them both grow to full maturity and then it will be plain which is which.” What does this look like in the world we face every day? Evil will mature. Righteousness will mature. The maturity will make the difference obvious. Then the angels will come and separate the wheat from the tares. No matter how long we are waiting one thing is sure: the church is becoming mature in the midst of the rapid weed growth around us. This is so hopeful!

  • One day, at our bible study, we were studying the prophecies and the end times. My husband said, “this is interesting and all but why does it matter to us if we won’t be here to witness it since we will be raptured”. I’ll be honest, I have read the book, but never really focused on understanding it based on the same thoughts. After a short reflection, my answer was that it was an opportunity for repentance. Indeed it is, but you are 100% correct, the book of Revelation does also offer hope. In watching the world around me, the things our youth are being exposed to and just peoples overall selfish mentality, Jesus’ coming offers me so much hope and comfort knowing that our Savior will come and save us all again. Prayers for you on that book Pastor Jeff, looking forward to reading it.

  • When I first joined my church’s youth group they were in the middle of a study on Revelation. I remember being absolutely terrified at the wrath of God and how it would be poured out on the earth. Every time I would leave on Sunday dreading the return of the Lord because of the horrible things that would happen. As I grew older I began to understand what Pastor Jeff pointed out, Revelation was not written to scare us but give us hope. We have a hope that is greater than anything here on this earth and Revelation gives us the signs to look for as we wait for Jesus.

  • Wow. I appreciate Jeff’s passion about the end times and how that pertains to biblical counseling ministry. I just finished reading through Revelation on my own and it was a fresh reminder that as Jeff mentioned, God is in control and we are to look up in expectation to Jesus return. I see all that is going on in our world and I just give it all to God. I try not to overwhelm myself with too much news but it is clear that events are shaping up for the anti-christ to make his entrance .
    Something Jeff said in the middle of his talk really got me to thinking about being able to empathize with those that God brings into my life to love, counsel and minister to. Several years ago, a deep, dark season of my soul that God not only allowed but led me through, has given me so many opportunities to bear with other women in empathy and prayer. When I went through that deep valley, there were many Christians who could not bring themselves to empathize with my situation but either judged me or were apathetic. I asked the Lord during that time to help me never forget the bleakness of my soul in that deep valley and to awaken my heart to any ladies who God may bring into my life who might be experiencing what I went through or some other painful situation in her life. The beautiful thing is that God did a great work and drew me into him which changed the trajectory of my life spiritually. I look for opportunities to bear witness to His Faithfulness.
    God knows what is to come and I look to rest in Him each day and look forward to the opportunities to serve Him and those around me.

    • Audra thanks so much for sharing how God used such a dark time in your life to allow you to have empathy for others in the same situation. Praise God that the time you spent in this valley not only transformed your own spiritual life, but also became a means of loving and ministering to others with understanding. Truly you’re using “the comfort with which God has comforted you to comfort others.”

  • I really didn’t think telling people whose lives are in a mess that the end is near was a good plan! After listening to this podcast, I guess I was wrong. If it produces the three fruits Pastor Jeff describes, reassurance that God is in control, to have a heaven-focused view of life and a renewed desire for purity, thanI am on board for that! I have a different understanding of the end times, ie. I’m not a “pre-trib” guy, but if I get to miss the tribulation, I will be delighted to be wrong! I spend quite a bit of pulpit time trying to show just how much and how fast our world has and is changing. Time is short, and while I long to meet my Messiah face to face, there are so many people out there who do not know Him; I know the work isn’t done, and we better get busy!

    • Hi James, as a missionary in France, I try to keep things very simple when I’m sharing with people. Just cutting through he Christian vocabulary is enough to confuse any average French person! However, knowing what you believe, and what hope you have is essential in having the confidence to speak with people who are very opposed! I never approach people by telling them that the end is near, though I do believe it, that is what gives me the strength and boldness to approach complete strangers to share the glorious salvation of Christ.

  • The return of Jesus Christ is such an exciting hope to look forward to. I do believe that we can be more sound and biblically literate when it comes to the study of the end of times. It’s not something I focus on too much. But if i truly look around i could see that the days are dark and very much like the end of times. People are lovers of self, lovers of money and rebellious to parents etc, evidence to what scripture says people will be like. But I really love the practical advice that we get from the Bible for these times: To look up and focus on Jesus. To cleanse and purify ourselves because our redemption draws near. It reminds me of Ephesians 5.. “See then that you walk circumspectly, not as fools but as wise, redeeming the time, because the days are evil. Therefore do not be unwise, but understand what the will of the Lord is.”
    ‭‭Ephesians‬ ‭5:15-17‬ ‭NKJV‬‬
    We do pray for more wisdom and a deeper relationship with God these days.

  • It is a great reminder that eschatology is so important in biblical counseling, especially now for the times we live in. I lead a ladies’ bible study group once a week. After the elections, several of the ladies were experiencing high anxiety to the point they were having trouble sleeping at night. I had to admit that the Lord had to rebuke me for a momentary lapse and had to remind me who my faith was in. I shared this with the ladies and reminded them that God already said it would be like this. We need to be prepared and not scared, as Pastor Jeff said. I could encourage them with the scriptures the Lord had given me when I woke up in fear after the elections. We were able to remember that God is in control, have a heavenly perspective, and renew our commitment to purity. “Look up for your redemption is nigh” becomes even sweeter words in my ears.

    • Hello Indra, thank you for sharing. I had a similar struggle after the election. God is in control. I needed that reminder because I am not in control. This is the scripture that God used.

      “Behold, the nations are like a drop from a bucket,
      and are accounted as the dust on the scales;
      behold, he takes up the coastlands like fine dust.
      16 Lebanon would not suffice for fuel,
      nor are its beasts enough for a burnt offering.
      17 All the nations are as nothing before him,
      they are accounted by him as less than nothing and emptiness.” Isaiah 40 15-17

  • I have been blessed by these podcasts. I will be praying for you pastor Jeff, Hopefully, my copy will have your signature on it. I have not read the book of revelations but I do feel that revelation should be implemented into biblical counseling. There was a time where I couldn’t imagine a God so big and all-knowing could love little me. Shortly after my wife texts me Romans 8, God knows all of our pain we go through in this world. And Revelation 7 God, Him self will wipe all our tears away. All I know is at the end of the story God wins and that itself brings comfort to my soul. Jeff mentions the end time is near, I pray that it is. I don’t care for politics and don’t watch the big news outlets. But, something that I found really disturbing was the number of so-called prophets that prophesied that trump was going to win. Even after their prophecy didn’t come to pass, people still seem to want to be hypnotized by their show. And being conceited used to be shamed now its applaud. People are becoming so self-centered they no longer have any shame. This could be the humanist physiological teaching, but it clearly removes the conviction God wants for our life.

  • Another great pod cast, Thanks Pastor Jeff and I will be praying for you as you begin your adventure into your writing. I’d be interested in a copy to read it when it was all done. Our pastor speaks on Revelation and the end times and he always used to tell us it’s not to scare us it’s to prepare us for what is to come. I never really put much thought into it until everything going on around me and seeing things going on and when the virus hit last year. I was having anxiety, and fearing everything, and my counselor brought up the end times and talking about Eschatology and how important it is. I started going over things in the book of Revelation and I see how important it is to be educated and informed on what is coming not only for ourselves but so we can show others. It calms my anxiety to know that God is in control of everything and nothing going on is a surprise to Him. When I start feeling fearful I just need to look up and keep my focus on Him and trust in His word and what is to come.

  • Thank you for the podcast Professor Christianson. We have a this blessed hope in Christ that no one in the world has. The hope of the second coming of Christ does bring understanding to the current events in the world. As Jesus says in Matthew 24:7, “For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. And there will be famines, pestilences, and earthquakes in various places.” These are the signs that Jesus tells us. As Christian we are not called to be fearful but expectation of his coming.

    “looking for the blessed hope and glorious appearing of our great God and Savior Jesus Christ, who gave Himself for us, that He might redeem us from every lawless deed and purify for Himself His own special people, zealous for good works.” Titus 2:13

  • I hadn’t really put these two things together before. But I can see the logical sense. In speaking with people who are upset about what is happening in our county and world, I remind them that God knows what is happening, and He is in control. They are full of anxiety about the crumbling of society, and how everything is turned inside out right now. People are polarizing in a way that I have never seen before (and I’m not young). There was time when Christians were held in esteem, but now the word ‘Christian’ has become a term of contention. This has caused a great deal of fear for some Christians, and it has pushed them out of the comfort zone of what being a Christian always ‘meant’ before. One of the saddest things we have witnessed lately is how so many churches/pastors/leaders are trying to straddle the fence so as to not offend the masses, but still keeping the ‘Christian label.’ I think this is a result of not trusting that God is absolutely still on His throne and aware – and to be very bold, I will say that I think this may be separating those who truly believe and those were simply comfortable with the Christian moniker and lifestyle.
    I am grateful for this podcast. It is very timely and needed. May God give us all the needed wisdom and words when helping our brothers and sisters who are trying to deal with this fear.

  • I never thought of this concept before when it comes to end times and counseling! It’s amazing how all of God’s Word works together so perfectly! What we believe on the return of Christ does matter so much! Unfortunately, I think we forget how important it really is when counseling in the here and now we tend to forget what is to come. Rev.1:1-3 BSB “1This is the revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave Him to show His servants what must soon come to pass. He made it known by sending His angel to His servant John, 2who testifies to everything he saw. This is the word of God and the testimony of Jesus Christ. 3Blessed is the one who reads aloud the words of this prophecy, and blessed are those who hear and obey what is written in it, because the time is near.”

  • This was a timely message. It really ministered to me in a way of changing my perspective into an eternal, Biblical, heavenly perspective. Often times, in the midst of the storms of life, I can easily focus on myself, the situation or circumstance, instead of reminding my self that God is in control. I love how P. Jeff mentioned 1 John 3:3, that those who have this hope in Christ purifies himself just as He is pure. The trials are meant to test me, try me, to see whether my faith is genuine and sincere and if I really believe that God is good, and that He works all things out for the good to those who love Him according to His purpose (Romans 8:28). He is a good God who has called me to bet set apart for His purpose, use, and glory and that is a life of continuous sanctification, in which He allows trials to purify my faith. It’s hard to think this way when my mind is so focused on the flesh rather than on the things above, Heavenly and Eternal Perspective. I love the points made in that having this mind set, there’s so much hope in Christ, and because of that it brings about my purity in Him. I love how P. Jeff mentioned that it’s not about frivolous living, licentious living, etc. It’s about being pure, it’s about being holy, it’s about looking up, knowing that our redemption draws near, it’s about being wise, it’s about living for Christ and to die is gain, and that everything is happening according to Biblical prophetic times, and not to be scared, but to be prepared.” When I am looking up, knowing God is in control, it should bring about purity in my life and this hope of my redemption drawing near brings joy and excitement rather than fear. The revealing of the end times, watching things unfold, should make me prepare myself to meet my King. In a sense, “The Place for Eschatology in Biblical Counseling,” should remind us and those we counsel that 1) God Is In Control, 2) Look Up and Get A Heavenly Perspective (Eternal Perspective), and 3) It Should Precipitate Purity. A very timely message and I really enjoyed the podcast. I’d love to hear more of the points to be mentioned so I’m praying for the book release and for P. Jeff.

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