64: Contrasting the Message of Psychology with the Bible


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  • Esther Ambie-Barango says:

    I appreciate Pastor Jeff Christianson for this week’s Podcast on ‘Contrasting the Message of Psychology with the Bible’ – continuing from the message of psychology contrasted with the Bible [the message that psychology declares (philosophical message coming from humanistic counseling psychology with respect to counseling methodology or psychology), and the message that the Bible declares]. Psychology has a heavy impact on our culture/ nation/ Church and most people are interested/ committed to integrating psychology into the counseling curriculum., thinking that it’s a great idea. However, we as Biblical counselors are aware that the Bible and psychology are in conflict and one of the greatest heresies in the Church is related to psychology/ psychological theory among others like self-esteem.
    Psychology in the Church is getting people to think in a way that isn’t Biblical but still go with Biblical overtones and is a subtle form of heresy and it’s important to warn Pastors/ Shepherds because they are the ones feeding the Sheep. Psychologists basically forsake the fountain of Living Waters; hewing themselves cisterns that can hold no water (Jeremiah 2:13).
    Christian communities (Churches/ homes/ ministries) all across the globe need to be alerted and equipped to be discerning.
    If the world around us aren’t on fire, burning for Christ, born again, Bible-believing Christians, they are not going to receive the things of the Spirit of God. The things of the Spirit can only be received by people that are born again; whose hearts are open to such – contending for the faith (not apologetics to those people outside the body of Christ – it’s about the gospel/ evangelism; it’s not about convincing them that psychology is wrong but the people outside the body of Christ need to be born again and be saved rather than convincing a worldly Christian or someone that’s not born again).
    We mustn’t be contentious nor argumentative but willing to do battle for the faith. The Holy Spirit expressly/ specifically/ pointedly/ openly says that in the last days, some will depart from the faith (apostasy) and as they do, they will give heed to deceiving spirits and doctrines of demons (1 Timothy 4:1).
    Carl Jung, a Swiss psychologist, spiritist, unlike a lot of psychologist; he wasn’t Biblically spiritual but was enlightened by demons; integrating demonically inspired counsel/ model of psyche and was the father of a variety of models that were birthed in the field of psychiatry, anthropology, archaeology, literature, philosophy, and religious studies; and people are embracing it. We must stay clear of these deceiving doctrines while reproving, rebuking, and warning people (Jude 1:3). We must be willing to contend/ do battle (not being contentious/ nasty/ mean/ spiteful/ bitter/ angry but contend) earnestly for the faith (the objective content of the faith is in the Word of God) which was once for all delivered to the saints.
    1 Timothy 4:6 implies that if we don’t do these things in the family of God for the people that we minister to – we won’t be a good servant/ minister of Jesus Christ but if we do it right – people can be nourished in the words of faith and of the good doctrine/ healthy teaching.
    As Biblical counselors, we are not just condemning/ attacking anyone, but measuring/ contrasting the message/ ministry of the Word of God against psychology: not the person but the message; striving to know the Word of God.
    In comparing and contrasting the message of psychology with the Word of God (note that not every area of psychological study receives people’s objection but there are some truly scientific areas of psychology); we are considering the area of theory of anthropology (speaking of mankind; seeking to explain why people are the way they are and how they change in theories/ techniques of psychological counseling) and psychotherapy.
    We should follow God more closely by returning to the Word of God prayerfully, more accurately, more perfectly according to the Word of God rather than psychological theory [1 Timothy 4:1, 6; 2 Timothy 2:15-16; Colossians 2:8; Jude 1:3].

    • Athena Williams says:

      Thank you Esther. I especially appreciate Pastor Jeff’s reminder that we aren’t condemning or attacking anyone. Sometimes it seems that people feel condemned or attacked, even when that isn’t our intention. Defenses go up when controversial topics are opened. We have to take extra care, go the extra mile, not to offend or overstep our bounds. Yet sometimes we also have to be willing to offend in order to speak the truth. It’s a difficult situation, but when someone is offended by our manner, we are out of line; if they are offended by God’s truth, they are out of line. It’s so important for me always to stay grounded in the truth so I don’t get swept away by the emotional turn of a conversation.

    • Ritter Savino says:

      It is true what is happening in our churches today and it is very sad how this part of Psychology is deceiving our churches, and people are believing it. They are giving in to this thinking which is not biblical; although it might look biblical. This is very dangerous for our Pastors and leaders and in general all Christians in our churches; we will be held accountable for what we do or don’t do.

  • Johan Alarcon says:

    Pastor Jeff, i really like the statement “The bible and psychology are in conflict”. Integration psychology and bringing it to the church and christian communities need to be aware. When we find ourselves in a conversation that may be questioning our faith, we need to use our discernment, whether to entertain the subject or not, and obviously when it comes to those outside of faith we need to really be aware spiritually, and be ready for what is thrown our way, and to not be like the world and get offended like most when someone disagrees. I remember a campus pastor I know told me that “to be apologetic outside of the definition is being someone who is apologizing to the unbeliever for not knowing the good news of Jesus Christ and then sharing the good news of Jesus Christ”. Psychology creeping in the faith, I’ve always thought this was very dangerous to do, and we as believers need to be ready and aware of the source of where this information is coming from.Hearing your testimony is very encouraging, being where you were, and then answering God’s calling, and in that obedience, I am also benefiting from this.

    • Esther Ambie-Barango says:

      Thanks for your response Johan and I particularly agree with you in line with Pastor Jeff’s teaching that ‘When we find ourselves in a conversation that may be questioning our faith, we need to use our discernment, whether to entertain the subject or not, and obviously when it comes to those outside of faith we need to really be aware spiritually, and be ready for what is thrown our way, and to not be like the world and get offended like most when someone disagrees.’.
      Discernment is key and we as Biblical counselors are equipped to discern, even as it concerns psychology in the Church; knowing that psychology makes people think in a way that isn’t Biblical although it has Biblical overtones and is a subtle form of heresy. It’s important to warn Pastors/ Shepherds and the Christian communities (Churches/ homes/ ministries) in general to be alert/ discerning because to know that psychologists basically forsake the fountain of Living Waters; hewing themselves cisterns that can hold no water (Jeremiah 2:13; Colossians 2:8; 1 Timothy 4:1, 6; 2 Timothy 2:15; 1 Peter 3:15; Jude 1:3).

    • Ritter Savino says:

      It is really sad how much and how often Christian get offended about this. Pride comes to mind and it is grieving to see the blindness of some of our brothers and sisters in Christ. It can also be as Pastor Jeff said, not knowing the Word of God as they should. We need to ask the Lord for discernment in all situations that come our way and let the Spirit speaks. The Word of God is pretty clear about its sufficiency and has proved itself truth. As you said, it is very dangerous how Psychology is creeping in the churches today, and they are embracing it. Prayer is a powerful tool, and we need to use it today more than ever. Thank you, Johan!

  • Anne Marie Maguire says:

    Thanks Jeff, I’m looking forward to hearing more about this topic of Psychology Contrasted with the Bible. I’ve personally seen a church destroyed by psychology, where the sermons are just motivational talks with some scriptures thrown in. I fear for the future as more and more rely on psychology to solve their problems and move away from the relationship, dependence on God. It does feel like we are in the last days. The self esteem lie is very strong and people spend years trying to pump up their esteem and are still in the same mess. But I have learned from personal experience that the more I deny the self and follow Christ the more peace and contentment and anxiety free I am and then all that is left is a constant trust and faith in Christ. It wonderful to be freed from self esteem. I feel I’m growing more in Christ because of this practice of denying self but it’s a daily process.

    • Johan Alarcon says:

      I am at a point in my life where if someone is teaching, preaching or has a big enough platform to be an influence on other people, if their words do not speak of or reference Christ, then to me there is space to question what is being said. I know that God uses even a donkey in the bible, and who are we to say that God can’t use phycology or anything of that matter, but it is when we idolize it and use it as the main source of truth, which we all know the source of truth Is the good news of Jesus Christ.

    • Athena Williams says:

      Thank you for sharing this, Anne. It’s so true, and unfortunately so many people insist on learning the hard way. I know I did! I tried to live according to the world, according to the flesh, and it led to despair. It sometimes shocks me that no one is looking around, saying, “Wow, there is so much more mental illness than ever before, so much more suicide, so much more substance abuse… when did this start happening? What’s the correlation with the spiritual condition of our society? What’s the TRUTH?” It grieves me to see so many people suffering, to know the answer, and to not be able to help them because they don’t see.

      • Anne Marie Maguire says:

        I am so thankful Athena that when I was first saved I was isolated in a small town with not many Christians around I had to learn to fully depend on God and my bible I attended a small church. During that time God imprinted on me the absolute life sustaining value of the Holy Scriptures above all worldly wisdom. God became my comforter and my healer. He lead me away from self reliance. I’ll always be grateful! Thank you Jesus for your beauty.

    • Margaret Deherrera says:

      I agree with you Anne Marie, as more and more people use psychology they are depending on self and others to fix issues totally going away from God and not seeking a personal relationship with God for the guidance and structure we truly need for healing I am also learning from personal experience the more I become dependent on the Lord and not myself, and letting Him be my guidance and my structure I base everything on the more peace I have and the less anxiety i get because when I try and lean on my own understanding i end up filled with anxiety and fear. But as i allow Him to be my everything the peace I have is so much better then the anxiety i used to get.

  • Athena Williams says:

    It was very interesting to hear Pastor Jeff suggest that 80% of Christians have been psychologized. That certainly matches my own limited experience, and what is even more surprising is how many of them don’t even realize the influences. It’s true that many believers aren’t even open to discussing the possibility that counseling doesn’t have to rely on psychological theory to be effective. We aren’t called to get into arguments with them, but we do need to converse with people about the theology they accept, and where it comes from. Many would probably be surprised to hear the truth about Carl Jung and some of the other “thinkers” that have influenced modern psychological concepts. We need to share the truth with those who are willing to listen.

    • Esther Ambie-Barango says:

      True Athena. I particularly agree with your response to this week’s Podcast; stating that ‘we aren’t called to get into arguments with them, but we do need to converse with people about the theology they accept, and where it comes from’. In the words of Pastor Jeff, we mustn’t be contentious nor argumentative but willing to do battle for the Bible. The Holy Spirit expressly/ specifically/ pointedly/ openly says that in the last days, some will depart from the faith (apostasy) and as they do, they will give heed to deceiving spirits and doctrines of demons (1 Timothy 4:1). It’s not a time to argue with such people about psychology or convince them about the sufficiency of Scripture but preach to them, fire them up for Jesus and draw them back to Christ.

    • Johan Alarcon says:

      I am guilty of using psychology when teaching or trying to prove my point. I used to think that the smarter I sound, I can shift the focus off of me and my defaults in communication. What I learned about communication is that there is an art to it, and we do not need fancy and long words to sound educated or to make it seem as if we know what we are talking about. The word of God and the spirit of God, speaks for themselves and we need not to ever add or subtract to the word. Truth stands, regardless of someone’s perception, and it will remain true whether they agree with it or not.

    • Jerry Troyer says:

      Athena, Thank you for your recognition that most people don’t even realize that which influences them. I agree most believers aren’t open to discussing the possibility that counseling doesn’t have to rely on psychological theory to be effective. I believe, that most people are so immersed in psychology that they do not even know to ask, consider, or ponder if there is another form of counseling that would dramatically resolve their life problems. We do need to continue to be witnesses for the truth. The truth is the Word. Thank you for your effective post.

  • Ethan Malis says:

    I think it is wise to say that we should always be on guard and understanding of ideologies that go against the story of Scripture. Scripture is our ultimate authority, and the teachings and practices of Jesus are the cornerstone of our lives. Mr. Christianson pointing this out in this episode, that we must be aware of the misleading and misguiding ideas from secular phycology. We cannot be intrigued to the point where we are listening to phycology without any sort of discernment. As Mr. Christianson said there is a form of phycology out there that is pattern based, scientific, and correct, but there is a community around phycology that can be dangerous, and this is what we must be aware of. It is good to learn from patterns in human history, this is what we do when studying ancient texts. So, we can learn from these sciences, but we must not be won over by their gospel. Our gospel is routed in Jesus Christ and new creation, not self-enlightenment. We must draw the line, or at least be aware that spiritual formation, and working through trauma is important, but understanding that it must be largely based off of scripture.

    Carl Jung is an interesting man, with many writings that are intriguing. Jung himself proposed that the biggest issue in the world is the majority of people leaving Christianity. Jung would go on to quote that if the world didn’t regain a rooting in the Christian teachings, then it would drift off to meaninglessness and individualistic culture. Now, is this a true statement? Yes, it is, but this is where we are careful, understanding that Jung did good and creditable research and even said many true things concerning God, but not taking his word for gospel. His word can be interesting and sometimes helpful, but never our foundation or cornerstone.

    • Esther Ambie-Barango says:

      Thanks Ethan for your reflections on this week’s Podcast (Contrasting the Message of Psychology with the Bible); particularly in restating Pastor Jeff’s teaching that ‘there is a form of phycology out there that is pattern based, scientific, and correct, but there is a community around psychology that can be dangerous, and this is what we must be aware of.’.
      Pastor Jeff clearly explained that in comparing and contrasting the message of psychology with the Word of God (not every area of psychological study receives people’s objection but there are some truly scientific areas of psychology); we considered the area of theory of anthropology (speaking of mankind; seeking to explain why people are the way they are and how they change in theories/ techniques of psychological counseling) and psychotherapy (Colossians 2:8 Beware lest anyone cheat you through philosophy and empty deceit, according to the tradition of men, according to the basic principles of the world, and not according to Christ.).

    • Esther Ambie-Barango says:

      Thanks Ethan for your reflections on this week’s Podcast (Contrasting the Message of Psychology with the Bible); particularly in restating Pastor Jeff’s teaching that ‘there is a form of phycology out there that is pattern based, scientific, and correct, but there is a community around psychology that can be dangerous, and this is what we must be aware of.’.
      Pastor Jeff clearly explained that in comparing and contrasting the message of psychology with the Word of God (not every area of psychological study receives people’s objection but there are some truly scientific areas of psychology); we considered the area of theory of anthropology (speaking of mankind; seeking to explain why people are the way they are and how they change in theories/ techniques of psychological counseling) and psychotherapy (Colossians 2:8 Beware lest anyone cheat you through philosophy and empty deceit, according to the tradition of men, according to the basic principles of the world, and not according to Christ.).

  • Ritter Savino says:

    Thank you, Pastor Jeff, for the Podcast. There is so much deceitfulness these days as the scripture says it will be. It is really sad that pastors, leaders, and Christian, in general, are giving in to this non-sense, and to ignore the instructions of the word of God, which is a really dangerous place to be. We as believers of Jesus Christ have a huge responsibility to know what is biblical and what is not, and to help our sisters and brothers in Christ to realize this responsibility we have within our church. 1 Timothy 4:6 “If you instruct the brethren in these things, you will be a good minister of Jesus Christ, nourished in the words of faith and of the good doctrine which you have carefully followed.” This passage is so clear about what God is asking us to do here; we are to instruct them in these things; we are not to ignore it. I think that Christian that are embracing these doctrines are lazy Christian because they are not taking the time to investigate and to compare it with the word of God. The Word of God is God’s counsel for our lives and nothing compares with it; His Word is sufficient. You are right when you said that too many in the church become defensive and that is true in my church. I have been in a position where there could be a group of people talking about a situation, and yet no one brings the word of God but instead they bring up a book to read or a video to watch; I had jumped in a few times, but at times I just leave. One of my friends before she became my best friend, told me that she has seen a therapist for 6 years and she felt she was not getting better. That was one of those moments where I spoke with her about how God has changed my life. Today, because she is one of my best friends, she has had the opportunity to see God move in my life. She had expressed she wants the same, but she is not ready to give it all to Jesus, so I’m just waiting and praying; it is going to be glorious when it happened! By the way, Pastor Jeff, I am so glad that you gave up your aviation career, and now you are serving the body of Christ in this so much needed way. It is so appreciated!.

    • Esther Ambie-Barango says:

      Thanks Ritter for your response/ post to Pastor Jeff’s Podcast on ‘Contrasting the Message of Psychology with the Bible’. I appreciate your submissions particularly on your highlight that ‘there is so much deceitfulness these days as the Scripture says it will be.’.
      1 Timothy 4:1, 6 Now the Spirit expressly says that in latter times some will depart from the faith, giving heed to deceiving spirits and doctrines of demons…. If you instruct the brethren in these things, you will be a good minister of Jesus Christ, nourished in the words of faith and of the good doctrine which you have carefully followed.
      My takeaway from Pastor Jeff’s Podcast; in line with your submission; is that, it’s important to warn Pastors/ Shepherds and the Christian communities (Churches/ homes/ ministries) in general to be alert/ discerning because to know that psychologists basically forsake the fountain of Living Waters; hewing themselves cisterns that can hold no water…

    • Johan Alarcon says:

      The word deceitfulness is huge to describe this day and age. I see the media especially, most of the time the news that comes from ads or someone’s page, you have no idea if it’s real news or not. I see how people get out of their way to create fake news and make it look like a credible source. I heard Denzel Washington say one time that “ the media doesn’t care if the news is real and truthful, it’s just to get it out there”, and making sure that they are the first ones to have this news posted. It’s sad that people don’t even care about their reputation any more. We as believers we know that we don’t expect anything good to come out of the world but when it comes to christians and indulging in the deceitfulness, will be held accountable to a higher standard because we know the truth and if we still deliberately
      choose to disobey buy compromising as the world does, deciet is around the corner.

  • alejandro anchondo says:

    There is an issue about the defensiveness in people on behalf of therapy and psychology. It is natural to all of us, in the flesh, to defend what we believe or what we have done in the past. For instance, I have known a few people who resisted becoming Christians because it would mean that their loved ones who had already died would be in hell. To accept Christ felt like renouncing any comfort they had received of their family being in a “better place.”

    I think most people are defensive for psychology because the whole world accepts it. But, that doesn’t help much. The whole world thought it was flat, and the whole world thought slavery was acceptable, and the whole world thought leeches could help someone who was sick. But people don’t think this critically about these things.

    Also, almost every show on TV has a character in therapy, or a psychologist as leading character. The TV shows paint them as successful experiences and powerful solutions to relatable problems. This makes people all over think positively about psychology and even open to going themselves.

    • Esther Ambie-Barango says:

      Thanks Alejandro for reiterating the ‘issue about the defensiveness in people on behalf of therapy and psychology.’. In the words of Pastor Jeff, if the world around us aren’t on fire for Christ, not burning for Christ, not born again, not Bible-believing Christians, they are not going to receive the things of the Spirit of God. The things of the Spirit can only be received by people that are born again; whose hearts are open to God – contending for the faith (not apologetics to those people outside the body of Christ – it’s about the gospel/ evangelism; it’s not about convincing them that psychology is wrong but the people outside the body of Christ need to be born again and be saved rather than convincing a worldly Christian or someone that’s not born again) – 1 Timothy 4:1, 6.

  • Jerry Troyer says:

    Pastor Jeff continues on in this intriguing series of podcasts concerning the psychologizing of the church. I was surprised to hear that 80% of the church is psychologized. Surprised in that I thought the number would be higher. All the churches I have been involved with have recommended going to a Christian Counselor. Usually an MFT. Many times not a Christian, just and MFT. Many employers have mental health programs available a discount. Of the few employers I had in the past, none offered either a Biblical Counselor or a Christian Counselor. A degreed and ethically certified psychologist (APA) or therapist is required for insurance to pay. That is another whole issue I will leave for another time.
    Many of the people, Christians, I have talked to about counseling had no idea, nor did they ask the type of psychology being practiced on them. Some knew they went to a Christian counselor but Scripture involvement was minimal or non-existent. I wonder how many pastors who have not been trained to counsel, have a true understanding of Christian Counseling compared to Biblical Counseling?
    Recently I was approved by a community church to Biblically counsel a member of their church. The Pastor and I communicated briefly by email. He had no questions for me other than my hourly fee and can I send the church an invoice as they have approved paying for two sessions per month. There was no way he could have researched my Biblical ethics and counseling as I do not have a website or online information. Perhaps the counselee described what I had done in the past? So, my question continues on to a Pastor’s recommendation of a Christian Counselor. Do they use the same approach as they did with me? I pray not.
    As students of Scripture we need to be aware of the differences and be able to speak to the differences between Bible based counseling and human crafted behavioral techniques. Which means we need to educate ourselves to at least a minimal degree of some of the processes of human created psychology techniques. We need to be able to Biblically defend our position when approached about cognitive behavior therapy, spiritualism, etc. We need to know the general principles of Freud, Rogers, Jung, Maslow and more. Otherwise how can we give a good defense ( 1 Peter 3:15)? Col. 2:8 instructs us, Beware, lest anyone cheat you through philosophy and empty deceit and according to the tradition of men, according to the basic principles of the world, not according to Christ. It may be and I believe it is so, that the only way to bend the curve of psychologizing the church is to inspire them to return fully to the Lord. Deepen their faith and have a burning desire to be discipled. Then there may be a change within the church.

    • David Bowman says:

      I agree with you Jerry. While there is value in warning others about the dangers of co-mingling biblical counseling and psychology, I do believe more education and biblical study is needed. I took a basic course in psychology but I don’t recall any of it. Nevertheless, the subtle seduction of psychology requires knowledgeable and Spirit-filled individuals that can explain the difference and contrast the two. I believe the experiential argument that Pastor Jeff brought up was especially compelling. Those that have received this type of counsel will probably be the most reticent to change or renounce its teachings. I pray that we will be used to bring people back to the lordship of Christ and His Word.

  • Tom Zimbelman says:

    A much needed podcast for us to seriously consider. I am grateful that Pastor Jeff gave up his career in aviation administration to dive deep into scripture and to follow Jesus – he answered the call. I have worked in the secular journalism world for more than two decades and am seeing, like never before, the culminating consequences of a society that has embraced humanism. I am bewildered at the amount of deceit that is communicated and accepted.

    As I was listening to this podcast, I thought how influential psychology has been on this country – it seems “nice” and “good” on the surface – it is presented well, but has a profoundly negative impact on our society, families, and also the church. Pastor Jeff is right: this philosophy has permeated deep within the church and has led to what I believe are other errors. We need to devote ourselves to Christ and permeate our minds and hearts in the Word of God. I appreciate Jeff’s steadfast warning in this area.

    • David Bowman says:

      Tom, I share your concern about the permeating influence of psychology. Pastor Jeff brought up the powerful defense that many levy against those of us that seek to hold onto the fundamental truth of the Scriptures. Who better to inform mankind on what they were made for and why they were made, than God and His inspired Word? But, you are absolutely right about the very nice appearance that this seductive teaching conveys. Interestingly, the church has been maligned for quite a while about being “anti-science”, when in reality, we are more “anti-psychology” or “anti-philosophy”.

      When it comes to the ultimate questions of significance concerning human beings, it’s either the Bible or an unholy mess.

    • Kristie Gallagher says:

      It is so sad to see how worldly psychology has permeated the church.We need to be those who continue to be steadfast in teaching and sharing God’s word. It alone has the power to heal and instruct. Nothing this world has to offer is able to do that.

  • Kristie Gallagher says:

    Hebrews 4:12 “For the word of God is living and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the division of soul and spirit, and of joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.”
    We are made up of body, soul and spirit, the Bible says that there needs to be a division, a distinction, between the soul and the spirit. The soul is the mind or the emotions of a person. The Spirit is brought to life when we receive Jesus. Romans 8 says, “For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit on the things of the Spirit” We as Biblical counselors need to understand the difference. Psychology aims at the mind or the subconscious, the will and the flesh. It is based on reform by digging deep and uncovering the past to help someone move into the future. Biblical counseling is a transformation of the mind. Applying the word of God and relying on the Spirit to do a new work. We need the mind of Christ, not the subconscious mind. As we submerge ourselves in the Word of God we will start thinking, reacting and living like the Lord wants us to. It is so important as we desire to be Biblical counselors to rely on the word of God to do the work that God has designed it to do. The Word of God and the Holy Spirit has the power to transform a mind and a life. We want the mind of Christ, not the mind of the world.

    • Jerry Troyer says:

      Kristie, Thank you for your perceptive and wise post. It is true that the world is looking to have the future changed by unwinding the past and somehow have that orchestrate a new path of life. Whereas we know that Biblical counseling is transformation of the mind. We aren’t trying to change a fleshly past by uncovering and now living it differently. We are discipling to change, and radically transform people in dealing with their problems so they can become kingdom ambassadors. Living their lives with healed issues through the Wonderful Counselor and advancing the Word.

    • David Bowman says:

      Kristie, Hebrews 4:12 is a great reference regarding this week’s episode. We should be very wary of disposing of the powerful tools we have available to us, namely the Word of God and the Spirit of God. Jeremiah 17:9, “The heart is deceitful above all things,
      And desperately wicked; Who can know it?

      When a sinful, fallible, and limited person tries to explain to you the way human beings are and why, they are being exceedingly prideful. We are unable to self-diagnose ourselves. Jeremiah 17:10, I, the LORD, search the heart, I test the mind,
      Even to give every man according to his ways, According to the fruit of his doings.

  • David Bowman says:

    This episode discussed the distinction between biblical counseling and the integrated counsel that is being offered by many Christian counselors. There has been a mingling or contamination of sole dependence upon the Scriptures. I appreciate Pastor Jeff addressing the subtlety of this heretical mixture. While we were encouraged to appreciate statistical psychology, we are warned against looking to outside guidance on the nature of man and the reason for their behavior. My wife learned some popular psychology regarding childhood development and education. She was mature enough to recognize where to “eat the meat and spit out the bones”. However, I wonder how many walk into these courses with the discernment to dispose of the doctrine of demons, while holding on to what is beneficial. I am interested in learning more about where the line is so that I can better counsel without being deceived or self-deceived.

    • Pablo Acosta says:

      Thank you for sharing it is a fine line that sometimes we cross consciously and unconsciously but our job is to take it to scripture
      I am glad that you are both convicted to do so.
      Amen brother keep at it

  • Margaret Deherrera says:

    Thank you for another informative pod cast Pastor Jeff. It’s scary to see how people in the church and the pastors can be easy manipulated without even known what is being done because people come in such a subtle way they don’t question philosophical theories. That’s why it is important for us to always look at the scriptures for truth, and never get caught up in self. We need to as Pastor Jeff stated be willing to do battle with Bible and using the Bible to those who we can counsel which are those that are saved. because those that are walking the flesh may disagree and be argumentative. Thanks for the reminder of the traps we can all easily get caught up in which is self love, self esteem, so many times psychological theories try and trap people into believing in self love, and self esteem. When we need to be dying to self and looking more like Christ. Letting the Holy Spirit be our guide and not ourselves.

    • Pablo Acosta says:

      Thank you for sharing
      I agree we can always see and check our hearts when it comes to helping and admonishing
      is it for us or is it for His glory
      Are we battling for our benefit or for HIs benefit

  • Pablo Acosta says:

    Amazing holy spirit inspired podcast, thank you for helping us and guiding us to scripture and how we must always compare and contrast everything we hear and not just take it for granted.
    I recently quit a job a had with a church because they continued to use psychology first in the kids ministry and trying to fit them all in a small square.
    Just like us kids love to hear the gospel, testimonies (age appropriate) and they listen. Thank you for this amazing time of hearing how we need to always be ready to help those close to us.
    thank you for sanctifying daily

    • Anne Marie Maguire says:

      So sorry Pablo that you had to quit a job with a church because they continued to use psychology. It is sad and isolating but your not alone my husband and I had to leave a church for the same reason which left us upset but God had opened our eyes! I am glad now. I pray God will provide for all your needs and bless you in Jesus name.

    • Gregory Nelson says:

      It is important that we test Scripture with Scripture. A lot of times people will hear what a pastor is saying, and then just take his word for it. This concept can be found in acts chapter 17 with the Bereans. They did not just take Paul’s word for it, they searched the Scriptures daily to see if what they were preaching was aligned with the Word of God.

      Acts 17:10-12 “10 Then the brethren immediately sent Paul and Silas away by night to Berea. When they arrived, they went into the synagogue of the Jews. 11 These were more fair-minded than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness, and searched the Scriptures daily to find out whether these things were so. 12 Therefore many of them believed, and also not a few of the Greeks, prominent women as well as men.”

      • Margaret Deherrera says:

        I agree Gregory, it is important that we go to scripture for truth, our pastor always tells us don’t just take my word for it let us look at the scripture to see the truth, because you can’t just take someones word even a pastors. It’s easy to get the Word twisted by others and if we don’t look at the scripture and believe what we are being told it can be taken way out of context and leading us in the wrong path. Thanks for showing the example through scripture where they did not just take Paul’s word for it, and they indeed searched the scriptures.

  • Greg Nelson says:

    We are definitely in the last days. In 2 Timothy 4, we see that a time will come when men will not endure sound doctrine.
    (2 Tim.4:2-4) “2 Preach the word! Be ready in season and out of season. Convince, rebuke, exhort, with all longsuffering and teaching. 3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine, but according to their own desires, because they have itching ears, they will heap up for themselves teachers; 4 and they will turn their ears away from the truth, and be turned aside to fables.”
    We see this so much in the Church in the day that we live in. So many of the televangelists are so “successful” in the worlds eyes, because they are telling people what they want to hear instead of they need to hear.
    When it comes too psychologizing of the faith you can see that people are all about feeling good, which is dangerous because this is when the enemy leads people away from sound doctrine of the Word of God.

    • Kristie Gallagher says:

      So true, when people put their feelings above the word of God is when the enemy can easily lead them astray. It is so important that we are founded on God’s word and allow that to lead us and to help others to trust in it.

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